Episode 201 — Science Supports DIET CHANGES
Guest: Julie Matthews • Date: April 25, 2024
Episode Overview
This episode is about the transformative power of food for you and especially your child. We’re joined by Julie Matthews, a Certified Nutrition Consultant and published researcher specializing in personalized nutrition for complex neurological conditions, particularly autism spectrum disorder and ADHD for over 20 years.
About Julie Matthews
Julie Matthews, MS, is a Certified Nutrition Consultant and published researcher specializing in personalized nutrition for complex neurological conditions, particularly autism spectrum disorder and ADHD for over 20 years. She received her master’s degree in medical nutrition, with distinction, from Arizona State University. She is the author of the award-winning book Nourishing Hope for Autism and co-author of two research studies demonstrating the efficacy of nutrition and therapeutic diet intervention for autism. Julie supports clinicians and families from around the world with her nutrition programs and professional training courses.
You’ll Discover
Items To Eliminate Now (6:47)
The Problem With MSG (8:25)
Gluten-Free Items To Be Wary Of (14:48)
Why It’s Never Too Late To Start (20:24)
Surprising Facts About Diet Changes (23:01)
A Little Known Diet With Surprising Efficacy (25:11)
The Power of Bioindividualization (39:03)
Referenced in This Episode
Full Transcript
Julie Matthews | 00:00
There is so much science out there from how a healthy diet helps with brain function to how specific therapeutic diets help specifically with autism symptoms. I mean, We know the research behind what's underlying the body, what are the underlying systems that are affected and how they can be factors that affect the brain. And we can use good food and therapeutic diets, special diets to help address those very specifically.
Cass Arcuri | 00:31
Want to truly be the best parent you can be and help your child thrive after their autism diagnosis? This podcast is for all in parents like you who know more is possible for your child.
Len Arcuri | 00:42
- With each episode, we reveal a secret that empowers you to be the parent your child needs now, saving you time, energy, and money, and helping you focus on what truly matters most, your child.
Cass Arcuri | 00:53
Welcome to Autism Parenting Secrets.
Len Arcuri | 00:54
Hello and welcome to Autism Parenting Secrets. It's Len, and with me is Cass, and she is beyond excited because this week we're diving into her favorite topic. We're really talking about the transformative power of food for you and especially your child on the spectrum. And we're joined by someone who was a very early guide for us. In seeing the path forward. Julie Matthews is a certified nutrition consultant. And published researcher specializing in personalized nutrition for complex neurological conditions, particularly autism spectrum disorder and ADHD. And she's been at this for over 20 years. She received her master's degree in medical nutrition from Arizona State University. And she's the author of the award-winning book, Nourishing Hope for Autism. And she's the co-author of two research studies Demonstrating the efficacy of Nutrition and Therapeutic Diet Intervention for Autism. Julie supports clinicians and families from around the world with her nutrition programs and professional training courses. And she's here today to share why food matters so much more than we think. The secret this week is... Science support diet changes. Welcome, Julie.
Julie Matthews | 02:29
Thank you. I'm so glad to be here.
Cass Arcuri | 02:31
Julie, we're so excited for this conversation. We're so excited for the light that you shined for us on our journey.
I mean, I remember having a conversation with you, what, at least 13 years ago. I can know the exact date because it was the date the American airline plane landed in the Hudson, right?
So the miracle on the Hudson, you and I were having a consult and your expertise really helped us understand the healing power of food and how foundational this is for so many parents. So just so excited to have you here and we get to You know, as Len said, that science proves and with all the work that you've done with your book and the papers that you have published, you know, let's kind of roll up our sleeves and get into this.
So thank you for being here.
Julie Matthews | 03:18
Yeah, absolutely. I'm excited to do it. Thank you for having me.
Cass Arcuri | 03:22
So, Julie, one thing I know from early on our journey is when I asked, you know, doctors as well as therapists and just practitioners about food changes, so many of them give you the eye roll. And so many of them just kind of think that food is, you know, if you want to waste your time and money, you can go down that path. And what I love about your book, as well as everything that you do, is you show parents that there is science behind food changes, you know. And so if we can just kind of start talking about that.
So for someone who's somewhat newly diagnosed or who has been told food is bullshit, can you know, let's just kind of dive right in and talk about how important this is for that foundation.
Julie Matthews | 04:07
Absolutely. This is a topic I'm very passionate about too, because even as a professional, I get this reaction as well. And I think it has fueled my passion over the years. And I love research. I love reading it. I love sharing it with families. And I love actually doing it.
So I'm excited to jump into this. So I mean, I think before we even get into the research, Most of us know that the food that we eat is going to help make us healthy or not.
I mean, just on a basic level, most adults and humans, I hope. Think that if we eat junk food and sugar all day, we're not going to be as healthy as if we eat vegetables and protein and healthy foods, hopefully.
So that is no different for children. In fact, it's more important. And it's even more important when we need to do some healing or when we have certain systems that might be a little imbalanced. It's even more important.
So just from a foundational level, the food we eat is important. Then we can look at all of the science. We have science, you know, I'm writing a new book as you and I were, we were all talking about before we got started and there's, Several hundred scientific references in my book. There is so much science out there from how a healthy diet helps with brain function to how specific therapeutic diets help specifically with autism symptoms.
I mean, we know the research behind what's underlying the body. What are the underlying systems that are functioning? Affected and how they can be factors that affect the brain. And we can use good food and therapeutic diets, special diets to help address those very specifically.
Cass Arcuri | 05:50
Yeah, because I think it's often I like to use the analogy of noise, right? So there's kind of noise in the system and food and ingredients can cause that noise. And if you have a child who has a diagnosis like autism, there's some noise going on.
So as much as you can kind of clean up that environment and clean up what they're eating, it's kind of important to kind of take away some variables that you get to control, right? And the fork is one of the most powerful tools that you have as to what is going into your child's body and how can you make it as clean as possible because of that food that they're eating is causing symptoms which I've seen over and over again what it can do for individuals. I know for my own son what I've seen. And these are often ingredients that parents kind of overlook.
Julie Matthews | 06:38
Absolutely. And some of them, fortunately, are really easy things that most of us can do without much difficulty, even just additives, junk food, artificial colors, artificial flavors, preservatives. We can find an equivalent of any food without even changing the diet. Again, as a nutritionist, I would say we don't necessarily want to have candy and cookies and things like that, but we could find a healthy version that is free of at least those additives. And there is a lot of research showing those additives contribute to anxiety and all of hyperactivity and all of that. And that's a pretty easy shift without a child usually wouldn't even notice if you switch from one brand to another, but just took out all of the junk.
So, and those things, can make sometimes dramatic changes. So that's, I think, a pretty easy place to start with taking out some of the things that can make their bodies either not make them not feel good or affect them in some way that they're not even aware of, but can have profound effects.
Cass Arcuri | 07:47
Right. And I think some of those additives can create that addiction factor that parents, you know, don't realize is kind of happening. But when you kind of change, I know for some parents who are listening, they're probably like, but my child will know if I change the brand. This is where the parent kind of stepping into their power to realize, you know what, one is you have to believe that food is this important to make these changes for your child. Because if the parent like, yeah, I'll change my brand. Try it, it's never going to really work that well because they're more likely to kind of take shortcuts as well.
Julie Matthews | 08:24
I definitely agree. I mean, even things like MSG, it's, monosodium glutamate, one of the things if you look at Even the mainstream conversation about it. And it's used in elderly people to stimulate their appetite because it stimulates the brain to say this food is exciting, eat more of this food.
So it literally works on that principle of having you want to eat more of it. And so, yeah, I don't discount the fact that there are some children out there that probably are stuck on specific brands. That to me would be a clue that there might be something in that food specifically that they might really be having a problem with and might be detrimental in some way.
Cass Arcuri | 09:07
Right. And I think MSG is a great example because, I mean, first of all, there's so many, but you don't have to list it on an ingredient list unless it's 99% pure.
And then there are so many hidden sources of MSG. You know, it could be a flavor. It could be just as spices. Very, I always say to parents, like, watch out for those generic terms on ingredient lists that where things can kind of hide.
So Julie, for someone who's just kind of getting started and wants to, you know, okay, I'm game to kind of try this. Is there like, I know that with your latest paper, there's 13 kind of different dietary interventions, but like for someone who's just getting started and someone who's listening, what would be something that you would say kind of, you know, start here.
Julie Matthews | 09:52
Yes, it would be nice. We can eventually jump into the 13 therapeutic diets because I think that there are some good diets data we can extract from that. But maybe we can even just start with my first paper, which answers your question, I think, pretty well. We looked at a multivitamin mineral formula We did six different interventions over the course of a year in a randomized control trial for children and adults on the autism spectrum. And so things were staged one month apart and then they were followed over the course of a year.
So it was a multivitamin mineral formula, a fish oil, essential fatty acid formula, Epsom salt baths. Carnitine, digestive enzymes, and a healthy gluten-free, casein-free, and soy-free diet.
So... With all that said, I think just if we break it down to maybe some of the basic things.
Some basic nutrient support, vitamins and minerals and good fats. And a healthy diet that's gluten-free and dairy-free. If we looked at that study, it gained about almost seven points in nonverbal IQ. Four and a half times the developmental age improvement and all sorts of improvements around anxiety and speech and sociability and all sorts of different things.
So I feel that, you know, getting some good nutrients is a great place to start and then getting a healthy diet. And then if you're ready to look at some special diets, Looking at gluten and dairy, I think are two really good places to start.
Cass Arcuri | 11:38
And I guess one thing, just thinking about it too, I liked how everything kind of was started a month apart because I think that sometimes supplements can have ingredients that are hidden in them. And I've heard of so many times where like, well, my doctor told me to take this, but I noticed X. It's like, well, then stop taking that. And maybe you can find a different supplement that might have, like you said, with food, right? There's usually alternatives to everything.
So maybe your child is giving you these clues as to maybe that's not the right thing for them. And you're going to have to find an alternative to that, you know, vitamin or fish oil or.
Julie Matthews | 12:14
Supplement. Absolutely. I think that is the great thing about Not doing everything all at once. And I am guilty of doing this in my own life all the time.
You know, I get excited about a new plan and then I do everything. I was just talking to my nutrition colleague the other day. I'm like, yep. I added four things all in one day and then I had a headache and now I don't know what was causing it.
So, you know, then I went back and I did one thing at a time and now I'm adding them. Like I try to tell my parents, but I don't always listen. One thing slowly ramping up and another thing slowly ramp up until I figure out what it was. And actually, it might have been none of those things because it might have been allergies or something else, right?
So all of these things can impact us. And that's why I think you're right. This concept of going one at a time so we can figure out what it is and then It's a lot.
And then if something works, we know what it is. And if something doesn't work, we have a better sense of what it is.
Cass Arcuri | 13:15
Right. And that's where, so for parents who are listening, who are kind of intrigued and want to get started, like doing everything at once, probably is not this. Hey. To stop a lot of the crap and garbage they're eating. I'm kind of like, great, stop sooner. But like, as you're introducing new things, really go slow and steady because that's going to give you data and information and child is going to give you clues that could be so beneficial and helpful for them as you kind of take that next step. Because for me, it's like this continuous journey and there's really, you know, you can always make more tweaks and improvements and add more diversity as you go and make changes and get curious. And what if I did this, but it's like, you've got to start somewhere.
So starting really slow when you add something new is really important and kind of just make sure you're always taking notes and observations. So you can kind of really pay attention to maybe not what's being told to you, but things that you see.
Julie Matthews | 14:11
That's great advice. Absolutely.
Cass Arcuri | 14:13
All right. So that first paper that you shared with the, now the gluten-free, casein-free or gluten-free, dairy-free for someone who's listening, it's not just about going to the store and buying everything branded gluten-free, right? Because there's a lot of crap on.
So when we went gluten-free, that was 15 years ago, we didn't have the options. And now I go into stores and I look at what's labeled gluten-free and I'm like, There's so much crap.
So like if someone wants to go gluten free, it doesn't necessarily mean just buy another packaged item.
Julie Matthews | 14:50
And it is sometimes that becomes an objection. Why not to do the diet? Because all of those products can get very pricey.
You know, it's fine if you need to switch out a bread for another bread and you're not a bread baker and you don't have all day to make bread. Sure, it's fine to switch out a few products that you need. But there are so many things just in our everyday life apples, rice, beans, meat, vegetables, all those things are already gluten-free and dairy-free. And so there's so many things that we can do that don't require processed, packaged, fancy foods. And you're right. A lot of them have a lot of corn in it. And corn can have all sorts of things from GMO to glyphosate to... Corn itself, which can be an allergen for people.
So I do think that the more whole foods diet you can do, the better. Now, if someone's brand new and they're just getting started and they're a bit overwhelmed and they want to find a new dairy-free butter and a new dairy-free cheese and maybe a dairy-free ice cream and a bread.
I mean, that makes sense. They want to substitute something their child eats for something else. But I think there's a lot of, like you said, like processed, packaged, cookies, treats, snacks, all this stuff that I don't think... Really in the end does a service to the diet.
Cass Arcuri | 16:13
Right. That's when Len and I support parents. One of my favorite things to do is like a pantry clean out with them.
Like, okay, share with me what you're, what's there. Let's look at the ingredient list together.
And then, like you said, there's always a cleaner alternative. So it's kind of like you can make swaps that are more mindful and specific, but it's just really kind of paying attention to kind of what's that baseline and where do you want to go? And kind of really what are their goals?
Julie Matthews | 16:39
Absolutely.
Len Arcuri | 16:40
I think I just wanted to throw in just to kind of anchor, you know, the kind of why we're even having this conversation again with parents who are, you know, trying to help their child. They're likely experiencing perhaps behaviors and symptoms the child has that they'd like to stop and to help prevent. To help their child. And they'd like their child to acquire skills and to develop. And so like there's these two main reasons is that food can help with both. And a lot of it does start in my mind with, okay, just let's stop The Poisons.
You know, let's try to reduce that in the diet and then move on to, you know, more nourishing foods, as you've talked about in terms of really helping that body be everything it can be. And I think the big reason why parents who may understand this to some degree for sure, I know I did, I didn't have a deep understanding. But I understood a lot of this. It's just that I didn't have a long-term view. And it was inconvenient. It took effort. And I feel like a lot of parents, even if they understand that this is something that's powerful, they give up too soon because they don't see the immediate effect of that. Is that what you've noticed with the people that you've Been coaching, Julie.
Julie Matthews | 17:56
That can be a concern. I mean, usually by the time people come to me, they've kind of tried everything and they're, you know, maybe in a slightly different place. But absolutely.
You know, I think this is why starting wherever you are is good. And, yeah. Making whatever changes you need to, you know, that you can make is a good place to start and avoid getting overwhelmed, which is why I didn't want to start with the 13 therapeutic diets because I don't want to overwhelm everyone.
You know, whenever I speak, there tends to be a pretty even split between a third of the people are brand new to diet. A third of the people are really experienced and have tried quote everything. And a third of the people are somewhere in the middle. And so I always say, you know, start where you are. And actually my 12-step process that actually my new book is going to highlight for everybody. And actually, people can find it on my website now.
So you can get it you know, get good sense of it. But it starts with simple things everybody can do.
So you can start with take out the junk food. Start eating a healthier diet, you know, and then it starts to get into some of the, more complicated or whatever you want to say, diets that take a little bit more time to understand and figure out if they're right for somebody.
So I think that, my goal, you know, nourishing hope is really all about just nourishing hope wherever you are in the process and wherever that is a great place. There's amazing things that you can do. And in fact, sometimes some of the most, some of the biggest changes happen in people that are brand new to the whole thing that start with some of the simple changes. So I think, Wherever you are, just start and go at your own pace.
Cass Arcuri | 19:41
And it's not you. And I love that some of your stories like. Adults were part of this. Because I think there's this misnomer out there that if your child's not recovered, might be a word people use, or kind of making progress by the time that they're five, when there's a window and it shuts. Making better food choices is really the span of your life. And it can impact, yes, it can have a positive impact as it relates for individuals with autism, but ultimately, Other health ailments benefit when you really start being mindful about, you know, what you're putting into your body.
So I don't think there's an age cap here.
Julie Matthews | 20:20
Absolutely. How many of us have heard about a 60-year-old or whoever who starts taking control of their health and all of a sudden they're healthier than ever? In that first study I mentioned, there was a man that was 58 years old and he got improvements from doing the diet and nutrition intervention. And so in the paper, we actually said that... This type of approach Has the possibility of helping anybody, no matter what age that they're at. And we've seen that. I've had people come up to me at conferences saying, their sister in their 50s has made wonderful changes with diet.
So it really, I strongly believe that there is no kind of magic window and that And looking at diet can help any of us at any time.
Len Arcuri | 21:10
So I think now's a perfect time if we can move into the 13 therapeutic diets in terms of The research that you did looking at that canvas that's out there, and as we all know, There's probably hundreds, if not thousands of special diets out there because once they come out, you know, they never go away. They're always floating out there. But that study that you co-authored looked at 13. Can you give people just a sense of what the ahas were that came out of that research?
Julie Matthews | 21:40
Absolutely. So just a few months ago, we published this study in the Journal of Personalized Medicine, and we looked at different types of You know, as you were saying, Lynn, taking out the junk.
So some of the diets involved taking out artificial additives, like the fine gold diet. One of them was a low sugar diet. One of them was a healthy diet.
So take out the junk, add in the healthy food. And then other ones were a lot of the gluten-free, casing-free diet. We looked at a soy-free diet, corn-free diet, food avoidance diet based on IgG and IgE testing.
So food sensitivity and allergy testing. Grain-free diets like the specific carbohydrate diet, paleo diet, the ketogenic diet, Those are some of the ones that come to the top of my mind. And again, What was interesting is a couple of things. One is that the survey was done. We had 818 people.
So it was quite a large survey. And the survey included psychiatric and seizure medications and nutraceuticals.
So while this paper was published specifically on the diet portion, there were papers published on those other two areas as well. And we found that diet was statistically significantly better at improving, at having a higher overall benefit. Then... Psychiatric and seizure medications, and actually nutraceuticals, which were supplements. A significantly lower adverse effects score than the psychiatric and seizure medication.
So they worked better and they had less side effects than that. Again, people might need to do certain things and I'm not saying that there isn't a place for everything, but wonderful to know that they had wonderful results with very little downside.
So that was one thing that I think was very exciting when we took them as a whole. Then when we looked at them, we looked at 24 different symptom improvements and found that different diets provided different improvements in symptoms.
So we suggested in the paper that symptom improvements or symptoms might be a way that people can start to personalize a dietary choice based on what symptoms their child has. So a couple... Kind of fun things about the paper itself. We found out that a, interestingly, a healthy diet, the number one improvement in symptoms was in health. And it was the top diet for improving health. And health was defined as less stress.
You know, illnesses and things like that. We found that a gluten-free and casein-free diet helped lots of different things from I'm just gonna pull, I'm actually gonna pull it up 'cause there's so many, there are about 700 different data points that we came up with.
So in a GFCF diet, 31% of people improved in attention, 29% of those that used it improved cognition, 25% in language and communication, 22% in diarrhea and hyperactivity. There were improvements in social interactions, all sorts of different things. If we looked at the Fine Goal Diet, and this diet looks at removing artificial additives as well as compounds called salicylates. We don't necessarily need to get into, but they can even occur in certain fruits and vegetables. Not that fruits and vegetables aren't wonderful, but we might need to refine the diet in certain people. The diet was very beneficial. It was one of the top diets, was one of the top diets in overall benefit and in symptom improvements. And 45% who used the diet had improvements in hyperactivity, 38% in irritability, 37% in attention, many in aggression, anxiety, cognition.
So it was a really great diet and had really wonderful benefits. And the last one I'll kind of highlight right now. I'm happy to go into any of them, but was surprisingly the ketogenic diet. Wow. The overall benefit was a little less and the net benefit when we looked at benefits versus adverse symptoms, the adverse effects, it was a little bit lower on the list. But when we looked at being a top diet for improving specific symptoms It really did a great job at improving specific symptoms.
So things like attention, cognition, anxiety, irritability, language, social interactions, constipation, things like that. It did a wonderful job. And of course, it was the number one diet for seizures, which is not surprising because it's been used for seizures for decades.
So Now, With that said, we don't just want to, I wouldn't say. Run out and just look at the top symptoms you have and necessarily always, you know, apply that diet because Some of the diets are more difficult than other diets. The ketogenic diet, for example, is very restrictive. And while it got some wonderful results, it may not be necessary for people they might get a similar result to a much easier diet and it's not eliminating an entire macronutrient or significantly restricting an entire macronutrient like carbohydrates where you really want professional guidance for it.
So again, I'm throwing these points out something might resonate with someone where something where they really want to ask their health care team about a certain diet. But you want to take I think it's important to take all these things into consideration... Because we can't just look at one or two symptoms and determine which diet is going to be the best. With that said, there were some wonderful benefits and each of the diets really had some amazing improvements for different people and different symptoms.
So I think that all of those things can be taken as a hole to help someone figure out how they figure out what is the best diet. For that individual.
Cass Arcuri | 28:18
Well, and I think part of, so two things, right? One is we're going to have the different studies that Julie has referenced as well as her book will be in our show notes.
So for anyone who wants to kind of read, and I encourage parents who are listening, print those out, email them, give them hard copies to your doctors. So, cause if they are looking for science, I think these are great references for people to really, Hey, you know what? Here you go, here's some information. Maybe we can start with something here, you know, as a starting point for parents to go from, right? And I think what you said, you know, everyone...
Julie Matthews | 28:56
Yeah, I think that's a great thing because if they tell you there's no science... Particularly the randomized control trial, It's, you know, it's really the gold standard in science, scientific research.
So I would find them hard pressed to argue with the science on that one. Now, it's not double blind if we want to get really super technical because it's very hard to blind the person eating food and the person making the food from the food that they're making and eating, particularly the person that's making the food. It's single blind, double, it's single blind controlled trial.
So it is definitely the gold standard. So it would be, I think they'd be hard pressed to, argue with it. And my experience is that they're just not familiar with the science, haven't read the science, and they've just heard the talking points out there in the world that there is no science.
So I think if we can share it might open their eyes a little. You know, if it doesn't, don't be discouraged, but it might.
So I'm you know, I think that's a wonderful, because I do think There are, I find more and more wonderful doctors, they're well-meaning and they just aren't aware and they are curious about it. And, you know, They could start with the abstract. It would take them five minutes. I think that's a good place to start. Then the other study, while it is a survey study of parents, It's like I said, over 800 people and it's the first of its kind to look at that many different therapeutic diets. Individual symptom improvements.
So I think that really does say something for coming from all of those people.
Cass Arcuri | 30:36
And I think with autism, right, there is no... Every child is different, right? There might be some similarities, but it's individual.
So it's really kind of. Knowing your child, fine tuning for what their needs are.
You know, we as an allergy family, I'm thankful for the allergies just because we avoided so much stuff that probably he would have been more reactive to. So we kind of, and it made me, I didn't have a choice.
Like I had to make specific choices based on, I didn't, you know, didn't want to cause harm. But for parents just to be that curiosity piece of it. The other thing is if you print these out and your doctor doesn't really seem to care, you remember have agency to maybe find a different doctor because you do want to, you know, it's really important. At least it was for us to have a, You know, not dread appointments and go to places where you actually feel really supported.
So I think, you know, providing them with the information that Julie has talked about and shared is a great first step in kind of finding, you know, what am I on this path here? Am I with a partner who's going to help us kind of navigate this? Because, you know, The information is slowly getting out for doctors. And the nice thing is there are so many curious practitioners out there who do want to help who just don't have, were never really taught that in medical school. And so if you can kind of share these with them, it might help them, you know, spike their curiosity even more.
Julie Matthews | 32:11
Absolutely.
Cass Arcuri | 32:12
The one diet that you don't hear so much about, but you've mentioned it a few times. So I'd love to just, you mentioned how the additives and the salicylates with the fine gold. Can you go a little bit more detailed on the parameters of that diet for the listeners?
Julie Matthews | 32:28
Yes, this is one of my favorite diets. I have seen such amazing things with it. I've had clients that were extremely aggressive you know every day out of the blue bouts of aggression virtually disappear. Lots of irritability, all sorts of things improving. And the study shows it with how well it did. The Feingold diet was created by Dr. Ben Feingold in the 70s. He was a pediatrician who realized that these Additives and natural food compounds called salicylates were creating hyperactivity as well as other symptoms in his body. And so he created this diet. It's been around for many decades now. And so some of those foods are things like berries and grapes and apples and cinnamon and honey and ketchup and spices. And again, some of these foods are wonderful foods, which is why it can be.. Confusing or seem contradictory or something like that. And it's a reason that not everybody needs to run out and try this diet. Although the underlying mechanisms of why I believe the diet is effective, some of the underlying biochemistry, is very common in a vast majority of children with ADHD and autism.
So that's why Kind of doesn't surprise me that the diet is beneficial. So. The easiest thing I think is the artificial ingredients, but if that's not enough for somebody looking at doing a trial of removing some of those foods can be helpful.
Some people might notice that.. Their child eats a lot of these particular foods. Now, granted, everybody likes fruit because it's sweet.
So that might not alone be enough. But if they are noticing a lot of the common symptoms and they're eating a lot of those foods, maybe they even notice that the reactions happen shortly after they eat. Although there can be a little of a delayed reaction as well, especially if they're eating all the time. But It's a... A diet that I think can be very helpful with behavior, with sleep, even with physical symptoms. Red cheeks, red ears, hyperactivity, inattentiveness, irritability. Those are some of the kind of just key ones that come to the top of my mind.
Len Arcuri | 35:11
It's an interesting diet because I've heard about it for decades. I've never run into anyone who's done it. But it's been around, and I think it does fall into that category of it's a diet that basically is eliminating – Toxins and poison, it's more about that than what you're adding in terms of nourishment.
Julie Matthews | 35:29
And.
Cass Arcuri | 35:30
I think often the thing that gets overlooked are like the berries and things like, you know, which are so many kids eat. I laugh because I guess we did. We've been doing fine gold for rye, but never really called it fine gold just because we were told years ago that red fruit or red fruit, red vegetables, as well as blue were something to avoid for him. And this was more based on his blood type, but it was kind of like, thing and we never did any food additives and things like honey. It was so funny because he's what, 17 now? The other day he texted me and he's like, is honey okay for me? And I was like, dude, I never gave it to you because I had read about some stuff. I'm like, maybe you try it at home before you try it out. But it was, yeah.
So I think for parents, if this speaks to you, it's just something to kind of read about the benefits that In the study that Julie says, if your child like you said, red ears, red cheeks, you know, there might be, you know, symptoms. Just watching your child for clues or watching your adult child for clues can be helpful in making what those decisions might benefit.
Julie Matthews | 36:45
You definitely. And Lynn, you had a good point on it is removing certainly the additives and the junk. It does remove some really healthy foods. And that's why... Two things, if you don't need to do it, You know, then we don't need to just have everybody run out and do it. However, there is a way to kind of balance that threshold and say, OK, well, they can have, you know, this much, but not this much. Or how do we improve the underlying systems that might be causing the reaction? A lot of times diets don't do that part. That's something that I'm pretty passionate about helping families figure out is why might they be reacting to this and how do we support the underlying factors that might be contributing to the reactions to these so they can go back to eating some of these wonderful foods.
So and. They might need to take out certain ones, but which other fruits and vegetables can they eat so we can still keep a healthy diet rich in all of these nutrients without... Using the ones that are causing them a problem.
Len Arcuri | 37:53
Yeah, no, that's dynamite. Going back to what you talked about earlier where, yeah, it's not as simple as looking at this study of the 13 and kind of scanning for your child's symptoms. Okay, I'm going to go with this one. But that's not a first step in terms of trying to figure out What is happening uniquely with your child? And again, this is something that can be overwhelming for a parent, which is why I'm excited there's people like you, Julie, who specialize on helping a parent to figure out what exactly is happening with their child. What might be at the root and therefore what diet changes may make sense. And if it happens to be a quote unquote special diet, great, but it's more than likely going to be some very unique diet. Combination And again, I think that all your work, I think you've talked a lot about the bio-individualization process. Of nutrition. Can you talk a little bit about that concept?
Julie Matthews | 38:49
Yes, so... A couple of things. And we talked about earlier that autism is a condition where every person is very unique. It's actually, there's a term for that. It's called heterogeneous. It's a heterogeneous condition where people have different underlying causes and different symptoms and different things like that. And there is good research showing that it is heterogeneous and that a personalized medicine and a personalized nutrition approach is beneficial. And I, being a nutritionist, have, you know, as you know, personally, certified nutrition consultant over the years had just came across this after working with people realizing, this one thing helps this person, but this one thing doesn't help this person. Why is that? Why does it help this one and that one? And I just started over time to figure out, Everyone needs something individual. We need to personalize their nutrition approach.
So I created a personalized nutrition approach that I call bio-individual nutrition. It really works on the bio-individuality or the biochemical individuality of the person.
So it's really looking at each person as a unique person that has different things going on internally, different nutritional needs, different food reactions. And so I have basically a methodology that I teach practitioners to do with their clients and patients and something that I teach my families to do in a kind of that more step-by-step process I mentioned.
Cass Arcuri | 40:22
Perfect. That was going to actually be my question was that do you train practitioners?
So knowing you just answered that. So that's great, because I do think for the practitioners who are listening, who are really intrigued. And I know, Julie, your first book, Nourishing Hope for Autism was is such a. Bible of, and you go really deep. It's very cerebral and you go into very specific details on that. But I think that is a tremendous reference for someone who really wants to go deeper and learn more about, you know, nutrition and, you know, the specifics of it too.
Julie Matthews | 41:00
Well, thank you. Thank you.
Yeah, a lot of the things that we talked about today are in the book. So if people want more on some of the food lists and some of the common symptoms and all of that, they can do that.
And then there is more complex science if they're curious, but if they're not, they can still get a lot of practical guidance from it too.
Len Arcuri | 41:20
Yeah, no, it's really important as a parent just to have the right people on your team. So the right doctor, the right medical provider, that's really key.
Someone like Julie with what she does and where she comes in really key to get that advice. I know with the coaching we do, we're all about helping parents implement. How do you take a lot of the guidance you're getting from these providers and how do you put it into action? Because that's where we find, I know we fell down a lot and we know a lot of parents need help with that implementation as well. And I know Julie, you helped them with that.
So just really appreciate what you've been doing for so long. Again, you were there early on as a real key influence for us. Because we understood the basic concept. But by really appreciating why this matters so much, Then you'll have the resolve and the resiliency to actually take consistent action. Because it's easy to discount. I know I didn't want to think food mattered. Because it was so super convenient to feed our son easy processed food.
So I think if parents are wrestling with this one concept, like it's a belief is that if you think that food really doesn't matter much, you're not going to really take actions. But if you really can embrace that it really does matter. And it sets your child up for long-term success, then that desire for them to be healthy may be greater than your desire to give them a treat in a moment.
Julie Matthews | 42:45
Very true. Very true. It's not always easy.
You know, it's not easy to change our diet as an adult. You can imagine for kids, it's challenging for them. And so you're right. If you don't have the resolve... To realize how important it is you know, it's, Easy not to do it.
So I do agree with you that and maybe that's one of the reasons I like to share the science to show people that it is worthwhile, that there are benefits that people can get from it. And it's based in science so that they'll realize it is worth trying it and seeing what's possible.
Cass Arcuri | 43:22
And I encourage families who are listening who want to do this for their child, but I would encourage you to join them. Because I do think the power of food, you know, food throughout history connects us. And if we're eating the same thing that our child is eating and not just making them have something, you know, different than everyone else, it helps connect the families. And, you know, autism is a condition that really is, you know, your child's disconnected. And so if you're really trying to connect with them and have a relationship with them and have them be a social being, then sharing food together can be such a powerful time, you know, sitting at that table and enjoying a meal together is something to work towards.
Julie Matthews | 44:10
It really makes a huge difference, you know, If I was on some sort of a healthy diet and My family member was eating brownies near me. It would be torturous for me.
So, you know, just from that perspective alone, you know, wanting everybody to be on the same page and to feel like they're all in it, everyone's in it together and You never know the benefit it might be to you as well, because I've had more than one client where a parent has lost 50 pounds or, you know, felt better, whatever symptoms they had improved. I mean, many experiences of that.
So you might be surprised. It might help Other people in the family, too. I've seen it help siblings and all sorts of things.
So I think for lots of reasons, that's a very good point.
Cass Arcuri | 45:00
Yeah, that was our story, right? I think I lost 20 pounds without even exercising when I gave up gluten and dairy.
Like it was just such a benefit. And I felt finally not bloated for the first time in my life.
So I do think, and as someone who has now been what, gluten free for close to 16 years, like I'm not going back. Like it just like, yes, at first it seemed like a mountain to climb. But now once I felt better in my body, it was like, no way am I going back. Back to that.
So I think it's, you know, for the parents who are really curious and who are interested, you might reap the benefits as well. But just realize the power in doing something together.
Julie Matthews | 45:42
I think you have a very good point that I would love to ask you a question. So when you first started, it sounds like it was more challenging, but... How is it now? Is it any more difficult now to do the diet you're doing now than to have gluten and dairy in the diet?
Cass Arcuri | 46:00
Well, I think when you start peeling back the layers and you realize what's in our food, right, how our food is grown, like chemicals, whatever it is. And then you feel how, you know, you feel in your body. Watching my son's progress, right?
Like food has been foundational for him, food for his sister, like his family. Sister was born two weeks after he was diagnosed and we implemented diet change.
So that girl's never had gluten in her life. It becomes really a lifestyle. And so, you know what?
Yeah. Is my life spent a little bit more time in the kitchen? It's, but I choose to do that, right? I choose. And this is why for any of our followers on Instagram, I post his breakfast every morning, just to show that it doesn't have to be a cereal for breakfast. And you can, you know, this morning was breakfast. Grass fed bison and Brussels sprouts and asparagus. And hey, I'm setting that foundation. And, you know, look what's possible.
So I think, you know, for us, it's, Was it challenging? Sure. Getting us on board together. Was it like, okay, we're going to change it, but it's our norm. And I wouldn't give it up and I wouldn't change it just because of what it has done for all of.
Julie Matthews | 47:12
Us. That's wonderful. Thank you.
Len Arcuri | 47:15
That's awesome. I know we could talk on and on. There's so many things to cover. We look forward to having you back on, Julie, especially when your book comes out. We're looking forward to that. And again, we just really thank you for sharing your knowledge, sharing your perspective. It is such an important topic.
So we can't cover this enough on the podcast. So again, really appreciate everything you've done. For all of your clients, all the people you're serving, but especially us on our journey, you are key.
Julie Matthews | 47:41
Well, thank you. Thank you. It's so nice to hear and it's so nice to see both of you. And thanks for having me on.
Cass Arcuri | 47:50
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