Episode 246 — SCREENS Prevent Connection
Guest: Melanie Hempe • Date: March 6, 2025
Episode Overview
Melanie Hempe, founder of ScreenStrong, shares her journey and science-backed strategies to help families break free from toxic screen habits. The secret this week is… SCREENS Prevent Connection
About Melanie Hempe
When her oldest son dropped out of college due to a video game addiction, Melanie Hempe used her nursing degree from Emory University to create a better, science-backed screen solution for her three younger children. The success of these solutions compelled Melanie to found ScreenStrong, a nonprofit that empowers parents to eliminate toxic screen use—and the conflict it creates—from their home. ScreenStrong’s proactive, neuroscience-based solution of delaying social media, smartphones, violent video games, and pornography through adolescence has improved the mental health, life skills, and relationships of countless teens and families across the world.
Melanie writes the weekly “Be ScreenStrong” Substack and hosts the popular ScreenStrong Families podcast. She has been featured on CBS, CNN, NPR, Fox, The Wall Street Journal, the Screened Out documentary, and other media outlets. Her Kids’ Brains and Screens series is available for all ages in book and curriculum formats.
Melanie lives in North Carolina with her husband, Chris, and their four children. She believes it’s never too late to reverse screen addiction and reconnect with your kids.
https://screenstrong.org/about/
You’ll Discover
The Worst Screen Type And The Worst Device (4:09)
The Case Against ISOLATED Use (11:13)
Why Understanding The Neuroscience Is So Key (18:22)
What Your Child Wants MORE Than Tech (22:29)
A Strong Call To Action (27:48)
Screentime Myths That Just AREN’T True (31:08)
Referenced in This Episode
Full Transcript
Melanie Hempe [00:00:00]:
It's highly addictive. So what you don't want to do is set your kids up for failure for down the road. You do not want to be the drug dealer and give them so much screen time that now they're addicted. Now they can't live without it. Now they will hate you if you take it away. Now they won't know what to do. You know, it's not a good idea. So later in life, after they're teenagers, maybe in their 20s, you know, then they can set different parameters.
Melanie Hempe [00:00:24]:
But we're talking about vulnerable brains. When kids are little, all the way through high school, that's when all these habits start and that's when all the derailment occurs and you're changing their brain. So every day that goes by that you don't have to rely on a screen, give yourself a star on a chart on your refrigerator and have a goal to find other things. There are lots of other things that you can do.
Cass Arcuri [00:00:52]:
Want to truly be the best parent you can be and help your child thrive after their autism diagnosis? This podcast is for all in parents like you who know more is possible for your child.
Len Arcuri [00:01:03]:
With each episode, we reveal a secret that empowers you to be the parent your child needs now. Saving you time, energy and money and helping you focus on what truly matters most. Your child.
Cass Arcuri [00:01:14]:
I'm Cass.
Len Arcuri [00:01:15]:
And I'm Len.
Cass Arcuri [00:01:16]:
Welcome to Autism Parenting Secrets.
Len Arcuri [00:01:30]:
Hello and welcome to Autism Parenting Secrets. It's Len. Today we're exposing a hidden threat to every family. Screen overuse. And my guest is Melanie Hempe. She is the founder of Screen Strong, a movement helping parents reclaim childhood from the grip of screens. And after her son dropped out of college due to video game addiction, she used her nursing background to create a science backed solution leading to Screenstrong, a nonprofit that helps families break free from toxic screen use. Through her Be Screen Strong substack and Screen Strong Families podcast and media appearances, Melanie equips parents with proven strategies to reduce screen dependence and strengthen real world connections.
Len Arcuri [00:02:19]:
And that really is the secret. This week, screens prevent connection. Welcome, Melanie.
Melanie Hempe [00:02:25]:
Thank you so much for having me. Isn't that so ironic to say that we feel like we're so connected on our screens, but really we're disconnected.
Len Arcuri [00:02:33]:
We truly are. And I think all parents sense that to some degree. But I think better understanding what's really at play here and for people not to just recognize it might be an issue and then move on. I think that's why this discussion can be really powerful. One reason why I really thought that this could be a powerful conversation is a lot of the parents who are listening who in some way have a child who's likely on the spectrum. Perhaps they're younger, newly diagnosed, perhaps they're older. But I know all parents wrestle with technology, but particularly within this community, you know, screens can be a lifesaver for parents. You know, they could, they could be just something that just helps with problem behaviors.
Len Arcuri [00:03:14]:
You hand, hand a child an iPad or a phone. And of course kids are addicted to those things, they want them. And then also on the other end, there's a lot of non speaking individuals who use iPads, let's say from an assisted communication perspective. So technology's here, it's a useful tool. But even for the families where it has a very specific positive purpose, I think playing defense is still really, really important for so many reasons. And again, I think making the case for why you would want to do that and just not of unfettered technology that your child and yourself are exposed to would be a good idea. So with that as a setup, I'll let you give your thoughts and your unique perspective.
Melanie Hempe [00:04:02]:
So I think that's awesome. So I think the thing we have to start with is the different screen uses, right? So we have passive screens and we have interactive screens. And passive screens are things like watching a ball game with your child or documentary and co viewing and watching that or maybe they're doing homework. Those things are passive, they're, they're not required to have the volley back and forth like an interactive screen. Interactive screen is like social media and you're scrolling and you're liking and video games for sure you're doing that even on YouTube videos that's somewhat interactive because you're swiping and clicking and going to the next thing. So it's that interactive screen category that is the biggest problem for all kids, regardless of where they are on the spectrum, whether they're on the spectrum or not. It's the hardest thing. And so the thing that is so important for parents to understand is that our kids, and us too, human beings, we're going to naturally be drawn to interactive screens.
Melanie Hempe [00:05:09]:
Now. We're kind of drawn, you know, maybe to the news in the evening and whatnot, but not as much as we are to that phone that's begging us for our interaction. And so because we're naturally drawn as adults, we know how hard it is. Let me you know how hard it is to put it down. And you all of a sudden look and you, you thought you were checking your phone for two minutes, and it's 20 minutes later. So imagine how hard it is for a kid to do this, and then imagine then how even harder it is for a child who may be on the spectrum, who's struggling with a whole other host of things we're struggling with. So while screen time can be a good thing for a learning tool and it's screen strong, we are not anti screen. That's not it.
Melanie Hempe [00:05:52]:
But, you know, while it can be a good tool, it can also be a very destructive and harmful toy. And we have to understand that kids are going to use this as a toy. They are not going to want to use it as a tool. We don't have families coming to us because our kids are addicted to Excel spreadsheets. Right? That's not a thing. Maybe some of our husbands are, I don't know. But. But our kids are not going to get addicted to that.
Melanie Hempe [00:06:17]:
So with that in mind, the second thing that we have to understand is the dopamine imbalance. When anyone is on a screen, and especially young kids and teenagers when they're on a screen, that dopamine gets revved up to the point where it just becomes toxic almost. Dopamine is a very important chemical for us. We would die without it. We need dopamine, but we need it in a very natural amount. You know, getting up to eat breakfast, to go outside and play, to go do your homework, all those things, that's natural. We get dopamine, we're around people, we get dopamine, but when we're on a screen, it triggers the area, the limbic area in our brain to the point where we're getting an extra dose and an extra dump. It is like a drug.
Melanie Hempe [00:07:04]:
And that's why when my son dropped out of college, I went to go pick him up. I didn't even know that he had dropped out. And I'm driving him home. And he said, mom, that World of Warcraft did something to me because I had to actually ask him if he was on drugs. And he said, no, I'm not on drugs. It's World of Warcraft. He was exactly right. It's the same dopamine, whether it's a drug or whether it's World of Warcraft or gambling or a pornography addiction.
Melanie Hempe [00:07:25]:
All the. All addiction is the same. It's dopamine. And so for your child who may be on the spectrum, they're getting the same dopamine, and it's very hard to manage. So that's the science behind it. So now we know that there's nothing really wrong with our kids because they're craving that screen time, but the way they react to it. Like with my oldest son when he was in high school, he would get really angry if we took his video game. Like if I walked in the room and I was like, I've had it.
Melanie Hempe [00:07:53]:
You know, Adam, it's enough. You got to come to dinner here. And I would try to take his screen, he, he would have an anger outburst because he was young, he couldn't control. It's a withdrawal, it's that withdrawal from the dopamine. So when you're dealing again with a child who's on the spectrum, they really can't control the withdrawal. And we are just constantly setting them up through the day. If you have iPads in your house, such a bad idea. I hate to tell you that having, I mean, Dr.
Melanie Hempe [00:08:25]:
Stacy and I and some other doctors I work with were like, the iPad was the worst thing that was ever invented because it is small, it is portable, it's easy to kind of forget about. Lay it on the couch, leave it on the kitchen counter. And then before you know it, your kids are hiding in a corner and they're on it and we don't know what they're doing. And it's just such a bad idea. The bigger the screen, the better when it comes for all kids. Because when this screen is big and it's in your den, for example, more than likely there's going to be co viewing going on, which is the one key that I want to really talk about today. And secondly, it's just, it's just harder to use as long because you can't carry it around with you all over the house.
Len Arcuri [00:09:07]:
You know, it's not as convenient.
Melanie Hempe [00:09:09]:
Yeah, it's not as convenient. Your time is going to be, the access is going to be cut down some. And then if your mom is sitting there watching it, even if she's doing the dishes, she sees what you're, you know, it's just not. You can't do as much stuff. And so it's really important that if we are going to allow screen time in our house that we co view it with and around our children. And I know that sounds bizarre and I know that people are going to say, well, one day they're going to have to learn to use it by themselves. And you're right, they will. And they'll also have to learn how to drive and drink and do other things, but they're not going to do that right now because they're not able to do it, we're going to do it with them.
Melanie Hempe [00:09:44]:
Just like when your kids learn to drive, you're sitting in the car with them and you're maybe having a heart attack like I was when I was trying to teach teenagers to drive. It's really hard. But back to maybe middle school child who is on the spectrum, they are not going to be able to say, oh gee, mom, I've been on for 15 minutes, I think it's time to get off. No way. No way are they going to be able to do that. And by letting them stay on it longer and longer, you're just activating that area of their brain, the limbic area of their brain that is making that dopamine get stronger and stronger and stronger. And now your withdrawal symptoms are going to get bigger and bigger and bigger. And part of it is maybe because they are on the spectrum, but part of it is just the natural thing that happens when kids have too much dopamine and you try to take the thing away.
Melanie Hempe [00:10:38]:
It's like trying to take candy away from a baby. Are you going to get mad at the baby for crying? No, you're not. Because you know what the reaction is going to be. So in a nutshell, that's kind of the summary of it. That's why if you want to sit down and watch a baseball game, that's a little different, they're not going to have the same overstimulation in their brain. If you're watching a documentary, you know, about a history thing or food or something, you can sit down, you talk about it, it's interesting. You're interacting with the person with you on the, on the sofa, that's different. But isolated use is not recommended at all.
Melanie Hempe [00:11:17]:
And even if they're trying to keep up with their friends, that's fine. You can bring your phone over and you can say, okay, let's text, you know, your, your friend and let's see if we can get them to come over and then it's done. But it's the never ending personal use that is causing so much harm. So again, we can talk about it like a digital diet, you know, food, we need food, right? Just like we need our screens to do things. But there are a lot of things about our diet that are toxic, just like there's a lot of things about screens that are toxic. And a lot of it has to do with the amount of food that we're eating, right? So that's one of the first things. We'll be obese if we eat too Much food. So our kids are going to get obese, right, if they are on screens, literally, and then also really figuratively, because they're going to get too much screen time.
Melanie Hempe [00:12:13]:
It's going to. It's going to overstimulate their brain already in areas that they don't need to be overstimulated. And I think, you know, Lynn was really interesting is about 10 years ago, when my boys were really little, you know, we had friends that had kids on the spectrum and they had kids that had ADHD and they had different problems. And they would come to me and they would say, well, my doctor says to put them on, to let them play a video game. That's going to calm them down. And no, no, no, that doesn't calm them down at all. You are revving them up now for the minute. You're distracting them, but you're not calming down their brain at all.
Melanie Hempe [00:12:44]:
It's revving up their brain. And especially after around 30 minutes, if mom and dad out there listening, if you see, yeah, especially after 30 minutes, he really turns into a bear. When I try to take it away, it's because the frontal cortex literally shuts down. And now we're being driven by our limbic area, you know, and so we say, okay, well, if they want to look at something for 20 minutes or 15 minutes, but who can do that? And we don't need to let them do it in isolation. That is huge. So if you're using screen time for a babysitter, it's cheap, but it will come around to bite you in the end. You do not want to. You will so regret it, because you're creating this habit and you're creating very bad habit.
Melanie Hempe [00:13:29]:
Because our brains crave good rewards and it craves bad rewards all the same, you know. And so you want to think of different things to fill their time, their downtime. That is the key to solving the screen problem, is that we find things to replace that time, that time. When you need some time, when you need a break, when they need a break, your goal is to find other things. And when they're really little, we say, have a box of special toys that when you need 20 minutes or you need 30 minutes, you bring that and then put it away for a few weeks, and then it's all brand new again. When you bring it out again, you have special things that you do. But if you get in the habit of having that iPad out every time you need a break, you are going to be regretting it later. You'll be really Sorry, later.
Melanie Hempe [00:14:21]:
Because as your kids get older, it gets harder and it gets harder and harder to manage. And we're not doing them a service, we're doing them a disservice. We're hurting their ability to self soothe and to self regulate and to fill that downtime with healthy activities. You know, some. Sometime people fill it with food and that's not good because then we end up eating too much. But finding natural things like a certain art book, going outside, a certain Lego set. Music. Listening to music is very calming.
Melanie Hempe [00:14:59]:
Playing music. I was recently at a school for autistic children and it was so wonderful because when I walked in the door there, these boys had made a drum set out of the desk and the chair and a stool and a backpack. And they were just. I mean, it was probably the whole hour that I was there, they were playing on their handmade drums. It was fabulous. But they didn't have to have a screen. Right. That teacher knew, you know, and she was so great.
Melanie Hempe [00:15:31]:
She was like, yeah, isn't it great? You know, we were all like so impressed that they were doing that. They danced, they were dancing a lot, and that was really fun. So put some music on. Dance in the kitchen while you're making dinner. There's a lot of things that you can do that you don't have to have the screen. Babysitter. Oh, my gosh. So it's so easy to pull that iPad out, isn't it?
Len Arcuri [00:15:57]:
As you said, it's endless, the number of things you could do. So it's not like it would be difficult. But in order for a parent to even think about doing something, they have to kind of understand that it is a problem. Right? So I think that's the first step for a parent to recognize that it is an issue if there's unfettered access to technology. And I think that's really the big kind of. For everything you just said, the big mistake, if you will, is that unfettered access to technology. Which is why you're saying some phenomenal suggestions, right? One, no technology in isolation. Right.
Len Arcuri [00:16:33]:
If you're going to use it, okay, sit on the couch. I'm in the kitchen. And that isolation piece, that I think is a very powerful move that a parent can make. And a kid won't like it, probably. Especially a teenager.
Melanie Hempe [00:16:43]:
They'll get used to it.
Len Arcuri [00:16:44]:
Yeah, they'll get used to it. Just, just like if you put some time limits on it, like, hey, here's the time that we're on our phone. There's a lot of Things you could do to put. To make it somewhat limited. And again, not. Not all access all the time.
Melanie Hempe [00:16:56]:
No, but it's going to be hard to do that. And parents are. It's going to be. You're going to have to discipline yourself and say, you know what? I fired the screen babysitter. She's gone, right? He's gone. Whatever. We can't use it as a babysitter now. It is purposeful, intentional time that we're going to spend.
Melanie Hempe [00:17:14]:
And then, you know what you're going to do is you're going to take that iPad and your phone and you're going to hide it because they will find it. And there is going to be some rub there, and there's going to be some back and forth, maybe for a week or so, but then everybody's going to get it. They're going to understand it. And you're going to retrain your children, all your kids, doesn't matter where they are on the spectrum. We're going to train. All this is true for every kid. And so it's hard for parents, though, because we want to think that we can use this for a babysitter and we can't. So you're going to find something else.
Melanie Hempe [00:17:47]:
You're going to have to replace your screen babysitter with another type of babysitter. And like I said, music does. Music is one of the best things that you can do. And then having some arts and crafts out on the table, having something they can build, you know, if they're. If they can do any kind of model airplane stuff or like Legos, of course, anything they can do with their hands to really engage them so they're not getting bored. But the best thing we can do for our kids is teach them how to have that downtime. And then the education piece that you're talking about, let's talk about that for a minute, because that is the number one thing that you have to start with. You have to understand as a parent and your child has to understand, why are we doing this? We have to understand the science behind it.
Melanie Hempe [00:18:35]:
Now. We don't have to all become little neuroscientists. That's not what I'm saying. But we have to understand some neuroscience here more today in our culture than we've ever had to understand at any other point in history. My mom, I can tell you, never understood about brain science, but she let us or made us go outside every day. You know, we went to bed early. We didn't have screens in our bedroom like she did everything right back then because that was just the culture. But she had no clue how well she was developing our brains by doing that.
Melanie Hempe [00:19:04]:
But today we have to get educated. And so our Kids Brains and Screens series, we have a whole series of Kids Brains and Screens, material for kids to learn in a curriculum in school. So if you have a school right now, it can be a supplemental curriculum or it can be a primary curriculum for digital citizenship, but it teaches kids about brain development, about what screens do to their brain, about. We have a fabulous thing about dopamine. So now all of a sudden, mom and dad, now you have the words and use it down, and you can look at the lesson and say, hey, let's learn about dopamine. Because this screen is causing dopamine, and it's too much dopamine, and we need to do other things instead. And so I have found that when we take all this emotion out and we stop making it an argument, and we make it a learning experience where we're learning about all this, now you have the words to discuss it, and you can say, see, you were on your screen too long that dopamine got too high, and now you're in a bad mood. Because when the dopamine drops, we all get in a bad mood.
Melanie Hempe [00:20:05]:
Mom and dad get in a bad mood too, right? And so now we can talk about it in a logical way. And that's what Screen Chong does. We train parents. We. We educate parents, and then they educate their kids. And one of the most requested items that we had about a year and a half ago was, can you write this for my kids? So that's why we have the Kids Brains and Screens course for parents, but we also have the book for your child. And next month, we are actually so excited, we're coming out with a home edition of the Kids Brains and Screens. So it's smaller, and it's not the full curriculum with all the quizzes and worksheets and lesson plans and activity sheets and all that, but it's just the home edition.
Melanie Hempe [00:20:47]:
So you can sit at dinner every night after dinner, read a lesson with your family, and show them the pictures. There's a. It's illustrated in a beautiful way for, like, middle school and up. And the. The picture. The illustrations are actually very educational because if you are reading it, you might not understand it. But then you look at the illustration, and it's like, oh, that makes sense. I get it.
Melanie Hempe [00:21:08]:
And your kids can get it. Even if they're little, they can get it all age kids can understand it and kids want to know. They want to know. They want to know what's hurting them and why are they acting certain ways. And I think it's so critical that we educate them. And of course, I always say, if you want to learn history, read a fifth grade history book. So that's why parents love our stuff, because it's written for middle school and up, but they can get it. Like, you'll understand neuronal pruning, like, maybe you didn't even know what that was.
Melanie Hempe [00:21:38]:
And you're going to understand that and you'll understand all the things about the solutions and you know, the, the best solution that we say is for parents to be coaches and to quit being a nervous parent. Put your coach's hat on and think about what would you do with your team if you had a losing team? You would change the game plan. You'd go back to the basics. If your baseball team can't hit the ball anymore, you're going to have to start having batting practice. You know, you're going to have to go back to the basics and you're going to be really firm. Some people call it strict, but you're going to be very loving and you're going to care tremendously about your kids. And that's why with Screenstrong and our whole plan that we have, it's very simple, but we have a whole plan to help you do the detox. But that's why people always say, well, don't your kids hate you if you take your screens away? And we're like, no, we have never gotten that response.
Melanie Hempe [00:22:36]:
Because you're spending more time, your kids see you care. It's like, oh, my gosh, you just educated me about all the science. Wow, Mom, I didn't know this. And I am so serious that they really want to know this and they want to spend time with you. Ultimately, that's what we're missing when we're on a screen. We're not spending time in person with our kids or our spouses or siblings. And that's ultimately what your kids are craving. They are craving time with you.
Melanie Hempe [00:23:06]:
So Screen Strong is about hitting that pause button and delaying the use of toxic screens. Not all screens, but toxic screens. And that toxic screens are video games, social media, and smartphones and pornography. Those are the three areas that we deal with. And those are the three most interactive screens that get us in trouble. And we have a lot of arguments in our home. So if you're having arguments in your home about screens and you want to stop that all you have to do is go through the screen strong program and you won't have any arguments anymore. Your kids aren't going to run around every day and beg for them.
Melanie Hempe [00:23:38]:
That lasts a few days or, I don't know, a week if they've been on it for a long time. But then you get over to the other side. It is so much fun. You start doing so many things with your family. You know, we teach you how to kind of plan your day different when you get home from school. Mom. You don't sit there and make dinner for two hours. You already have that done ahead of time.
Melanie Hempe [00:23:55]:
You're doing things with your kids. You're actually investing in them. You're helping them with their homework if they need to. You're getting them outside. You might have to get a dog. We're really big on getting pets because that's a very big thing that you can use for downtime, to fill downtime. So instead of an iPad, how about if we just all get a dog and we can go walk our dog?
Len Arcuri [00:24:15]:
Wow, that's quite the swap. And yet I think that's ingenious.
Melanie Hempe [00:24:19]:
Yeah. What do you think? It's a great investment, right? Either that or you're going to have a lot of therapy later. So you might as well just get a dog now or treat trampoline. Or, you know, trampolines are really good, too. Get a really nice one.
Len Arcuri [00:24:29]:
Everything you just shared in the last five minutes. I mean, I can't add anything to it. It's all extremely true, particularly in terms of what does your child really want? Right. It isn't the iPad. They do want connection. That's why that's the secret this week is that screens do prevent that connection. So with that truth, though, I also just want to throw out there that I can absolutely understand everything you're saying, Melanie. And I can also understand what other parents who have a child, perhaps who's got more significant behavioral issues, where the screens are, as you're saying, definitely an addiction.
Len Arcuri [00:25:04]:
But in addition, for that child and for lots of kids on the spectrum, it is something that they do that does calm their nervous system, or at least they believe that it's helping them be regulated.
Melanie Hempe [00:25:16]:
So I think that if you understand the science behind it and if you understand the risk that you will find another way to calm your child. Years ago, there were plenty of ways to calm autistic child, right? This is not the only way. This is a very dangerous way to do it. So while you may agree, and we may all Agree. Oh, yeah, it works to a certain point. It's not, it's not really calming them. It's making them get so distracted that. Because like at the dentist office, my dentist tells me in the pediatric dentist office, they just pull iPads in with video games.
Melanie Hempe [00:25:52]:
And they don't even have to do their pre op drugs when they're getting ready to work on a kid's teeth. And they use this in, I'm a nurse. And they use it in the surgery center. They can literally not give pre op drugs. They're giving the time. Ten years ago they were using Game Boys. Now they're using iPads to distract and overstimulate certain areas of the brain. But it looks like the kid's in a coma, right? Because they kind of are, but it's not because they're calm.
Melanie Hempe [00:26:18]:
The amygdala is going to shut down. And that's a whole nother science behind it. We explain in the curriculum, we explain what happens when you get overstimulated and that fight flight comes into play and then your amygdala shuts down. And that's a really bad thing when that happens because that's like your little alarm center. And when you don't have your alarm anymore, it's a whole thing. And that's really bad. So, so what we have to do is think out of the box. We gotta get rid of the iPads.
Melanie Hempe [00:26:39]:
I'm telling you, we can't stand iPads. And there's so many reasons why people just think they're for kids, I think, and they're not. It's like giving your kid a smartphone. Is an iPad the same thing? I mean, it's the Internet, right? But there's some weird disconnection in our parent brain because we think, oh, look how cute. It's like a little mini computer. It must be okay. Well, like a little mini Playboy magazine wouldn't be okay. You know, just because it's mini doesn't make it okay.
Melanie Hempe [00:27:06]:
And that's the other thing that with your autistic and down syndrome and all these other different categories that we are dealing with in this one school that I am familiar with, you know, they have, they're, they're hypersexualized sometime and they get really drawn into the sexual content and that becomes something that's really hard to break that habit in. That addiction gets really hard. So what you have to do is think about this as really highly addictive to substance, which is exactly what it is. It's. It's an activity it does the same thing. Same dopamine. Remember, whether you're gambling or, you know, some people are addicted to shopping. Some people are, you know, so it's activity or a drug.
Melanie Hempe [00:27:45]:
It's the same pathway in your brain. So it's highly addictive. So what you don't want to do is set your kids up for failure for down the road. You do not want to be the drug dealer and give them so much screen time that now they're addicted to. Now they can't live without it. Now they will hate you if you take it away. Now they won't know what to do. You know, it's not a good idea.
Melanie Hempe [00:28:07]:
So later in life, after they're teenagers, maybe in their 20s, you know, then they can set different parameters. But we're talking about vulnerable brains. When kids are little, all the way through high school, that's when all these habits start, and that's when all the derailment occurs and you're changing their brain. So every day that goes by that you don't have to rely on a screen, give yourself a star on a chart on your refrigerator, and have a goal to find other things. There are lots of other things that you can do, so many healthy things that you can do to fill that void.
Len Arcuri [00:28:50]:
Yeah, it's an important and it's a compelling message. And I think everything that you're sharing, particularly with the science and the ground that you covered, is something that's really important for a parent to digest. And that's in addition to a lot of the prior episodes that we've had on this podcast, have talked about the concerns or the dangers of emf. So, like, for magnetic fields and the like, there's that physical issue, too. So while that's still relevant, you're talking about really more from a science perspective, from an addiction perspective. And so again, all that applies, plus these key insights that you're sharing today. And I guess one final question I'll throw out at you is, and you can tell me if I'm off base with the way I'm looking at it, everything you said applies, no matter what the age of the child or the adult. Right.
Len Arcuri [00:29:38]:
Minimizing screen use is important, but I have this belief that particularly for very young children, let's say up until the age of 12, exponentially more important to limit the time then, because as you get older, I think the potential for downside is less. Is that. Is that. Am I off?
Melanie Hempe [00:30:00]:
The way I see it really? Like, yeah, it's the. The earlier you start, the harder it's going to be to undo the issues. But I believe that there, there's certainly downsides all the ages. But like with the smartphone, for example, you get very, parents get very lulled into this sense that their kids are getting more mature, they're getting better, they're getting more, you know, able to handle things. And, and that may be their 10 and they're 12 and, but then all of a sudden they're 14 and they do a U turn. This is really con, this is completely child development. It's they, and they, they, they get worse. They get worse.
Melanie Hempe [00:30:40]:
So there's like a U turn that happens. They use their screens very differently at that age. So it's almost worse to have screen time during that, you know, middle school and high school than it even is when they're five, even though it's really bad when they're five because now they're just getting accustomed to having it and now they're every, every minute that they're on their screen, they're not outside playing and doing something like staring even at the wall. Doing nothing is better than being on a screen. So it's not, it doesn't progress like you think naturally. It's, it's worse. There are more suicides at the age of 16, screen related, social media related video game related suicides at the age of 16 than are at the age of 10. And it's because of the adolescent brain development and what happens there.
Melanie Hempe [00:31:22]:
So that's a myth. Another myth is this idea of moderation. You can't moderate it. You can't moderate an addictive activity or substance. It's, you wouldn't say, oh well, let's just have a little cocaine today, right? We're going to moderate cocaine or we're going to say we're going to moderate porn. Let's just watch one porn video every day instead of letting your kids, you know, watch a, like that doesn't make sense, right? So moderation is fine with certain things in life, but we certainly don't moderate everything in life and we especially should never moderate something that's going to be addictive, that has a high rate of harm for our kids. And the risk is so harm, the harmful, the risks just don't, you know, make sense when you look at the benefits that they don't match up. It's not worth it.
Melanie Hempe [00:32:06]:
It's like it's not worth it to put your 10 year old in the car and drive around the highway and let them drive like that. That's a high risk. It's not worth it. Now if you were having a heart attack and your 10 year old needed to drive to the hospital, maybe the risk is worth it. I don't know. I don't know that. But it's just the benefits aren't there. And if they want to have a flip phone and call their friend, then have a flip phone and call their friend.
Melanie Hempe [00:32:29]:
They need to be in person with people all the time. Like they need to be together with their friends. That's your goal. Your goal is to find two or three screen strong families that your kids can play together, they can visit together, they can do art together, they can play outside, they get on the trampoline together, they can do walk the dog together. And that's your goal. That's how you're going to be, that's how you're going to feel downtime. And then you can start by having a book club and you can use our new home edition. It's almost out.
Melanie Hempe [00:32:54]:
And that can be your book club. And you have a book club and then you start letting your, your kids meet other kids from the parents in that book club. And it works like a charm. This is, we have so many success stories of this working. So you're going to hit the pause button and you're going to learn how to do other things to fill the time right now, for now. And it's not forever, but it is for now. And I'd loved all your questions and I love, you know, about the kids. Yeah, it seems like it would be worse, you know, for younger and it gets better when they're older.
Melanie Hempe [00:33:24]:
But I, I'm a firm believer that that's not true. It's a whole nother set of problems when they get older.
Len Arcuri [00:33:29]:
I think I might be like a lot of parents where I'd like to take the foot off the gas a little bit, you know, especially as my kids get older into the teenage years. And again, that's selfish but, but again, I think you've given a lot of parents, I think a very different way of looking at this. I have some thinking to do as well in terms of, in terms of what I'm doing. And yet it's, it's not the easy route because it takes intention.
Melanie Hempe [00:33:53]:
It takes, it is easier though than you think. Let me interrupt you. I'm just saying you. I raised a video game addict. That was hard. Then I raised three kids that didn't have video games and smartphones. That was the easiest thing we ever did. It was so easy.
Melanie Hempe [00:34:08]:
And they are so thriving and Evan just. Just put up his third Spotify album. He does piano. And Andrea, we're leaving tomorrow to go to one of his concerts. You know, my daughter was a D1 athlete at a school in gymnastics. Like, she didn't have social media for any of that. They didn't have social media. They didn't have video games.
Melanie Hempe [00:34:26]:
Yeah, we watched documentaries as a family, and we did. We did a lot of fun things. They have way more memories than their older brother ever had. So if I could just tell you the detour around all this is so worth it. It's not hard. I think that's. That's such a big misconception. It is so much easier.
Melanie Hempe [00:34:46]:
And you really like your kids more. Sorry. And they like you more. You know, Adam's like, mom, I had a terrible childhood. I'm like, I know, honey. You did. I'm so, so. I'm so sorry.
Len Arcuri [00:34:57]:
Well, as you said, it may not be hard, but I know for a fact it's inconvenient because it's not what other people are doing. So that's where, like, a lot of things on this parenting journey, inconvenience usually points the way to what's going to be most powerful, the biggest that you can give your child.
Melanie Hempe [00:35:12]:
Yeah, but they. You know what, they had a flip phone when they got when they were 15, and it was fine, you know? Yeah, there's a few little things here and there, but it doesn't weigh up, you know, for all the benefits they got for all the different hobbies that they did. Interest, and they hung out with their friends a lot. We spent a lot of money on food over here for all their friends, and that was the best thing we ever did. I'm like, okay, counseling or money for food. I'll pick this one over here. We'll make a lot of hamburgers. So that's how you have to look at that.
Melanie Hempe [00:35:44]:
But thank you so much for having me. I really enjoyed today. Thank you.
Len Arcuri [00:35:49]:
Well, thank you so much. And just one more time, if you could just tell parents where they go for more information in terms of what Screenstrong is doing. And, you know, just tell parents where they should go.
Melanie Hempe [00:35:58]:
Yeah. So you want to go to screenstrong.org and when you get on there, you can get in our Connect group. You can also take a look at our Kids Brains and Screens curriculum that we have for kids. Be sure and show that to your principals at school. And that's what we're really promoting now with this new Home Edition coming out next month. We're so excited that it's coming out in March, the very end of March. We have a podcast as well as a substack every week and if you scroll down and some of our substack articles, you'll find a couple of articles on this topic there. But look out for that midweek every week.
Melanie Hempe [00:36:34]:
And then also our podcast, we have different guests on. Please reach out to us@team screenstrong.org if you have any questions. You can get into our connect group and we have tons of parents in there that will help you if you have very specific questions. And I just want to encourage everyone that you can do it. This is not hard. We now know the problems. We have all the research. Now we've got your back over here.
Melanie Hempe [00:36:58]:
We're going to help you educate your kids and you're going to get over this hump and you will never look back. You will never look back. We never have parents say, oh dang, I wish I had given my kids that iPad more. You'll never look back on that. It's only 48 months, right. Of high school. It's so short. It's so short when you get there.
Len Arcuri [00:37:16]:
Oh, that's great. Well, I really again, appreciate you taking the time and I think this is, this conversation is such a gift. So thank you very much.
Melanie Hempe [00:37:22]:
Well, have me back and I would love to come back and hear some stories from some of your listeners about they gave it a try, so let me know. They can do our seven day challenge or we have the 30 day challenge too to help to help them get off.
Len Arcuri [00:37:35]:
Fantastic. Thanks again, Mel.
Melanie Hempe [00:37:36]:
Thank you.
Len Arcuri [00:37:38]:
Your child wants you to transform now. And the fastest way to do that is with personalized support. To learn more, go to allinparentcoaching.com intensive.
